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Post by seeyouallnextyear on Mar 14, 2012 22:43:52 GMT -5
So, just to get an idea of how many of us are out there in this situation:
- How many of us are going to have to try again next year?
- If you will have to try again next year, what is your strategy?
Right now, I am conflicted about what to do next.
This was my first year on the market with a degree in hand and a post doc. The thing that I've noticed the most is that, compared to last year as an ABD, I've gotten more bites from research places and much fewer from teaching ones (as an ABD I actually got an offer from a teaching place, but chose the postdoc thinking it would help me more). I wonder how much my postdoc affected that, and so I am uncertain on how to prepare for next year. Do I get some adjuncting gigs to try to have better luck on teaching places? Or do I go all out on pubs for r1s?
Now, I don't want to make this all about me, so please share whether you will be on the market again, and what is your thinking on your strategies.
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what do you want to do
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Post by what do you want to do on Mar 15, 2012 7:27:23 GMT -5
Uhh, do you want to teach or do you want to do research? Don't tailor your activities to get a job, tailor them to what you want out of the profession. (This is probably a decision you should have made years ago)
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Post by well on Mar 15, 2012 8:43:14 GMT -5
Uhh, do you want to teach or do you want to do research? Don't tailor your activities to get a job, tailor them to what you want out of the profession. (This is probably a decision you should have made years ago) Not exactly. Increasingly, there are places with heavy teaching loads that also look for and expect one to have a research agenda. Of course the expectations are lower than that of an R1, but they aren't zero. Same goes for research places - it helps to have taught at least a couple of times. Trying to do a decent amount of both because one is willing (and wants to be able) to apply to both types of places is not a bad way to go in a market like this. |
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Post by disagree on Mar 15, 2012 8:47:24 GMT -5
I disagree that you should have to decide whether you want to teach or do research years before you go on the market. First of all, I think that as academics, we should all have a balance between the two and strive to do both well. Unfortunately, most schools lean more one way than another. As someone who has done interviews at liberal arts schools, comprehensive state schools, and research-intensive schools, I would say that the best thing to do is to try to be appealing to ALL of them in order to give yourself the most options. Having good pubs and lots of teaching experience will only help you in the end no matter where you'd like to end up.
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ohh
Full Member
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Post by ohh on Mar 15, 2012 9:18:17 GMT -5
I was on the market this year after a 2 year postdoc and found that I got a lot more bites in general, compared to when I was on the market right after my PhD.
Yet I think the postdoc changed my image: SLACs did not seem interested in me, only schools that had a lot of teaching but wanted some research, or schools that wanted a mix of the two or teaching with a very strong research agenda.
That being said, if you are interested in teaching schools, make that abundantly clear in your cover letter, if you haven't been doing that already. Go do teaching pedagogy workshops, etc, to keep building that letter and CV.
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Post by seeyouallnextyear on Mar 15, 2012 9:43:59 GMT -5
While I thank you all for the advice, I was hoping that this thread would be more about the people who are trying again next year, and what they are thinking about in terms of strategy.
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Post by academic problems on Mar 15, 2012 10:53:19 GMT -5
Seriously, if you don't think that decisions about what path to pursue early in grad school don't have something to do with separating those who get coveted R1 and SLAC jobs from the rest, you're naive. This is why there are so many complaining about the job market. Lift your head up and look around.
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Post by Notsureyet on Mar 15, 2012 11:34:38 GMT -5
I have one more interview that I'm waiting to hear back on. Assuming I don't get the job, I'll be back on the market next year.
I've arranged to delay my dissertation defense (should I not get the job) though, so that I can stay on as a graduate student (delays loan repayment, keeps health insurance, minimizes teaching load).
As for strategy - this year, I only applied to a select number of positions. Next year, I'll broaden my job search.
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Post by drbearjew on Mar 15, 2012 12:39:32 GMT -5
I finished my PhD in December. I've had three phone interviews - an R1 and two SLACs - and made the short list at two other R1s. To be honest, I'm fairly disappointed that I was not able to secure a fly out to any one particular place.
I've been offered a director position at a very established not-for-profit. My plan is to take the position, and test the market next year. I have two papers under review at very good journals, and two chapters in edited volumes that just came out the past two months. So, my 2012 will not look inactive.
In addition, I plan on adjuncting with my PhD program to keep my teaching record consistent.
I'm told these things happen - but, I was also told they wouldn't happen to me by the very same people.
For those in similar positions, stay focused and keep working through it. Good luck to everyone.
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Post by silentbub on Mar 16, 2012 0:06:09 GMT -5
I've been on numerous SCs at both a small public and SLAC. Both places like to see strong teaching and some research. To be very honest, we rarely took people with strong research backgrounds seriously (e.g., postdoc with little to no teaching experience, ABD or PhD with numerous strong research pubs [it's a good thing to have a lot of teaching pubs]). Both departments did not want to be stepping stones, and many of us believed that a CV packed with research demonstrates that a person wants to be at a R1. If you want to be to be seriously considered for a teaching gig, you'll want to get as much teaching experience as you possibly can if you've been a postdoc for a while. Make sure that your letter talks up your strong interest in teaching.
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Post by ANotAmused on Mar 18, 2012 21:00:28 GMT -5
Please don't read this if you think I'm just trying to complain about my situation... I'm just trying to share some of the pain/disappointment that lots of others here are feeling...
<rant>
I will be on the job market (again) next year. This current academic year has been my FIFTH consecutive year on the market. (I won't even tell you how many jobs I've applied for during that time, it would boggle you minds.) First two prior to getting my PhD, another after getting my PhD and being offered a position I (foolishly, I now understand) accepted. I take full responsibility for joining a department that is in 11th-hour disintegration-mode in the smallest and most conservative town I've ever lived. So, I have now been on the job market for two years as an assistant professor (for those keeping track: 2 + 1 + 2 = 5!). Funny thing is that during the first four years I had six on-campus interviews (only two offers, at my two least desired schools) and another nine phone interviews, but this year is the only year that I have not had *any* interviews whatsoever (well: not true... I had one non-academic interview, my first in eight years!). I have now taught nine different classes, I get good evaluations, and have published eight peer-reviewed articles. I assumed I would become more marketable as time went on, but my suspicion is that SC see me as someone who has personality issues/can't commit (not true!). Oh, and the school I got my PhD from probably doesn't turn any heads. I wonder if things are also (structurally-speaking) still hard for me/some of us because: schools are still not hiring much (at least at pre-2008-levels: thanks bankers!), lots of folks like me on the market who have been holding our breath for a few years, and graduate programs still cranking-out all the new PhDs? Ugh, if only universal health care existed, my partner and I could get busy on creating our permaculture farm and organizing for revolution full-time...
</rant>
Good luck everyone... hope you find what you're all looking for. Keep working hard and treating your fellow people right. Or, at least the advice people keep giving me...
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Post by hobbyhorse on Mar 20, 2012 14:21:48 GMT -5
To ANotAmused - if you think that search committees have the wrong impression of you, perhaps you could have someone at your current institution write a letter of support for you...there must be someone there who is sympathetic to your case and who would be willing to indicate that you are not on the market because you can't commit or for reasons of departmental politics, etc...
But what I don't understand is why you think *others* think you can't commit - it sounds as though you have only held one job, right? SC's aren't going to remember from year to year whether you applied in a previous cycle...
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Post by silentbub on Mar 20, 2012 22:54:30 GMT -5
SC's aren't going to remember from year to year whether you applied in a previous cycle... Actually, we do remember the applications that we seriously considered and the ones that were "different". Not that this would rule you out for next year's search but we certainly remember. Of course, I'm at a SLAC. Other places/people might exclude you outright. I'm not saying that this is typical of a R1, but there was a faculty at where I graduated from (a "top 20" school) that said that he/she excluded all applicants from the previous 3 years (his/her words - "If we didn't want you before, what makes you think we want you this year?"). A bit snobbish of this person? Probably. I don't think it's typical though. I know someone that interviewed at a place two times and got the job the second time around. The person got a lot of coaching the second time around. |
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Post by lawandsocdude on Jul 1, 2012 2:10:21 GMT -5
For a person just finishing his PhD this summer (I defend in ten days!), I think I had a pretty good year, although I didn't get an offer - one phone interview for a TT and an on-campus for a one-year teaching position is more than I expected. Right now I'm wondering how to pay for my expenses this month - my first summer session adjunct class evaporated due to the CSU budget cuts, so I'm scrambling and not finding work, which is scary - but I have three good co-authored papers out there for review, which should boost my applications a little next year, I hope. I did neglect the research part of the degree because I'd much rather teach, but now I'm thinking that was stupid of me.
I'm also going to be much more aggressive in pursuing work. I sent out about two hundred and twenty-five applications for the 2012 hiring season. I figure I'll need to do twice that this year.
I'm just wondering if my age is going to be the thing that hamstrings me (I'm in my forties). I'm trying very hard not to get depressed, and mostly succeeding most of the time.
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Post by hmm on Jul 1, 2012 22:03:12 GMT -5
To the above poster--first of all, good luck with defending! That's a huge accomplishment and it will feel amazing to be done once and for all. Secondly, I really feel your pain about the crumbling California public school system. I interviewed at two CSUs this year and one was an inside hire and the other hired someone who has been out for over five years and published a book with Stanford. The competition is insane and I don't think that any amount of teaching is going to outweigh fewer pubs or no solo-authored pubs. But the season is early and you still have a couple months to make yourself a better candidate.
Regarding the age thing, I think that people tend to go by appearances. I've got a friend who is 40 but looks 30, and no one seemed to have any issues with her and she got multiple offers. I've got another friend who is 40 but looks 45, and she has felt age discrimination and hasn't received any offers. Not to say that age was a deciding factor for either, but it has been interesting to compare.
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